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The Puzzler

Egyptian evidence in Australia

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louie

I thought it was proven that it was fake, made by university students. but what about the claims of a cover up of egyptan artifacts in Tasmania and new south Wales.

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The Puzzler
There is very good reason to think that they walked the entire way. There is a submerging continental plate there which today is, in part, under the ocean (the Indo-Australian Plate.) Might have been dry land there 40,000 years ago.

The current theory is that the Aborigines are descended from peoples that were living in India 40-50 thousand years ago.

But those people were not exactly civilized. There was no civilization anywhere on Earth at that time.

Also - no way at all that the Egyptians ever made it to Australia. Complete hogwash.

Harte

Did you read the awareness quest link from Crystal Sage stating of several Egyptian items found here in far Nth Queensland and all over Australia. How can you be so sure that Egyptians in Australia is hogwash? Are these items figments of peoples imaginations or do you think they were bought here by people other than Egyptians or do you think every one of those items is fake? The heiroglyphics I first mentioned may be fakes but what about the other items? How are you so sure they were never here? Every bit of earth everywhere has not been dug up, maybe the crucial bit of evidence has not been found yet. Australia is a huge island continent, much now inhospitable, every day new discoveries are being made here. Just west of me is a famous site called Riversleigh which only recently uncovered so many new species of mammals in a square metre and in a space of a few days it was mind blowing to the world of archaeology. You might like to check it out if you havent heard of it, it's very interesting. My book called The Antipodean Ark is very interesting reading also in relation to that. You might think I know nothing but I am actually very informed about Australian history.

Also you are wrong in your first sentence, according to my own book Archaeology of the Dreamtime I will quote a sentence:

"The first migrants could not have walked to Australia but must have come from across the sea. At no time in the last 3 million years has there been a complete land bridge between the Asian and Australian continents and before then the Gulf was even wider."

Aboriginals have been in Australia in excess of 53,000 years according to recent archaeoligical evidence in the Northern Territory reaching Arnhem Land at that time. If Aboriginals have been in Australia for 53,000 years you are wrong again that there were no civilisations anywhere on Earth 40,000 years ago.

There is no Asian mammals in Australia which is evidece that for millions of years there has been a significant water barrier between Asia and Australia.

One favourable time for entry into Australia would have been 70,000 years ago. The smallest gap at any time between islands is 90 km.

Anyways this is not part of my equation about Egyptians in Australia but just a point to show you you don't actually know everything. You may find my book Archaeology of the Dreamtime very interesting reading actually.

Edited by weareallsuckers

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sirfiroth
If Egyptians came all the way to Australia, they should leave marks on their way. From Egypt to India to South Asia and to Australia. But inter-cultrural similarities may have not be found between Egypt and any of these places.

There is very strong evidence that the ancient civilizations of Egypt, Britain and Mesoamerica were indeed in contact or there was an Antediluvian civilization as the source of the information given below.

1. Same unit of measure used at all locations.

2. The same ratios like π =22/7, the Cubit derivation formula, and a host of other visual representations of common ratios etched in stone.

3. Use of the Pythagorean Triangles at Stonehenge, Teotihuacan and Giza.

4. Use of Septagonal formula construction at Stonehenge, Giza and Teotihuacan.

5. Same concepts, principles and elements of mathematics as generated and demonstrated by the Kings Chamber of the Great Pyramid.

6. Like number sets generated by the structures measurements and mathematical formulas concepts and elements from Giza and Ancient India.

7. The likely source of this information a mother civilization predating recorded history.

All of this can be mathematically validated! Demonstrating the same units of measure used in Australia, New Zealand, India, and many other places. I have done the research and can verify at least the ancient structures of Giza, Luxor, Stonehenge and The Complex at Teotihuacan were built within the same time span of 12,500 years ago. I have no doubts the Ancient Egyptians visited Australia long before Mainstream Archeology is capable of imagining. There is information that is powerfully indicative of an world wide civilization that predates recorded history, namely Atlantis and Lemuria. Which in reality will prove the Egyptians did not build the Pyramids, any more than the Aztec and Mayan civilizations built the Pyramids of Mesoamerica, they only inherited them. Mainstream Archeology seems more interested in preserving Mainstream Archeology than arriving at the truth.

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The Puzzler
There is very strong evidence that the ancient civilizations of Egypt, Britain and Mesoamerica were indeed in contact or there was an Antediluvian civilization as the source of the information given below.

1. Same unit of measure used at all locations.

2. The same ratios like π =22/7, the Cubit derivation formula, and a host of other visual representations of common ratios etched in stone.

3. Use of the Pythagorean Triangles at Stonehenge, Teotihuacan and Giza.

4. Use of Septagonal formula construction at Stonehenge, Giza and Teotihuacan.

5. Same concepts, principles and elements of mathematics as generated and demonstrated by the Kings Chamber of the Great Pyramid.

6. Like number sets generated by the structures measurements and mathematical formulas concepts and elements from Giza and Ancient India.

7. The likely source of this information a mother civilization predating recorded history.

All of this can be mathematically validated! Demonstrating the same units of measure used in Australia, New Zealand, India, and many other places. I have done the research and can verify at least the ancient structures of Giza, Luxor, Stonehenge and The Complex at Teotihuacan were built within the same time span of 12,500 years ago. I have no doubts the Ancient Egyptians visited Australia long before Mainstream Archeology is capable of imagining. There is information that is powerfully indicative of an world wide civilization that predates recorded history, namely Atlantis and Lemuria. Which in reality will prove the Egyptians did not build the Pyramids, any more than the Aztec and Mayan civilizations built the Pyramids of Mesoamerica, they only inherited them. Mainstream Archeology seems more interested in preserving Mainstream Archeology than arriving at the truth.

Wow, how interesting! That is excellent information and I for one have no doubts either that Egyptians visited Australia and what an interesting concept of the Egyptians inherited the Pyramids. By the fact that Aboriginals arriving in Australia before any great civilisations were known is proof enough to me that a mystery civilisation was indeed around and that man does not know as much as he thinks he knows. World renowned anthropologist Claude Levi-Strauss calls aboriginals "intellectual asistocrats" among early peoples. they had sophisticated religion, art and social organisation, an egalitarian system of justice and decision making, complex far flung trading networks and an ability to adapt and survive in some of the worlds harshest environments. That to me is a sophisticated civilisation going back over 50,000 years. The earliest ones we acknowledge began around 5,000 years ago, the Sumer. Big difference. Although farming had begun in around 10,000 BC. I am so glad you contributed to my thread, I shall be investigating this more! I would be interested in any more you can tell us about.

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jaylemurph
SNIP

Aboriginals have been in Australia in excess of 53,000 years according to recent archaeoligical evidence in the Northern Territory reaching Arnhem Land at that time. If Aboriginals have been in Australia for 53,000 years you are wrong again that there were no civilisations anywhere on Earth 40,000 years ago.

SNIP

I'm with Harte on this one. Groups of wandering people do not a civilization make.

We have no record of specific and continuing cultural identity, enduring social structures, architecture, language/literature, religion or crafts that would suggest an actual civilization.

--Jaylemurph

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Harte
Did you read the awareness quest link from Crystal Sage stating of several Egyptian items found here in far Nth Queensland and all over Australia. How can you be so sure that Egyptians in Australia is hogwash? Are these items figments of peoples imaginations or do you think they were bought here by people other than Egyptians or do you think every one of those items is fake?

I did read a lot from that link, and found it extremely wanting.

The artifacts you're talking about are merely listed there, without any provenance, mostly. The few that had accompanying pictures didn't look at all Egyptian to me.

If you're gonna make a claim of Egyptians traveling to Australia based on a Ptolemaic coin, as the website does in one place, you should realize that the Ptolemaic kings of Egypt were Greek, not Egyptian. This was during Roman times as well. Yet nothing Greek, Roman or Egyptian remains to tell us of this feat? Please.

How can I be sure it's hogwash? I believe I already gave my reasons, the Egyptians were incapable of sailing that far. They bragged on and on about reaching the mouth of the Red Sea, for God's sake! How is it that they reached Australia (much less India, Madagascar, Indonesia, etc.) and never left one single indication of it at home or abroad, yet there's all sorts of paintings and carvings memorializing several different voyages to Punt, just down the coast?

Also you are wrong in your first sentence, according to my own book Archaeology of the Dreamtime I will quote a sentence:

"The first migrants could not have walked to Australia but must have come from across the sea. At no time in the last 3 million years has there been a complete land bridge between the Asian and Australian continents and before then the Gulf was even wider."

There is no Asian mammals in Australia which is evidece that for millions of years there has been a significant water barrier between Asia and Australia.

Regarding the Aborigines walking to Australia, you might be right. The absence of Asian animals, though possibly explained by their being outcompeted by native animals, is nevertheless a strong argument.

I don't pretend to know exactly how much land on the Indo-Australian plate was above water at the time. But it's a cinch that it was no great sailing voyage. This is because of the Ice Age at the time and the amount of water that was locked up in the ice.

Aboriginals have been in Australia in excess of 53,000 years according to recent archaeoligical evidence in the Northern Territory reaching Arnhem Land at that time. If Aboriginals have been in Australia for 53,000 years you are wrong again that there were no civilisations anywhere on Earth 40,000 years ago.

You have an extremely odd and out of touch idea of what constitutes a civilization. Either that or you thought I meant "culture" when I said "civilization."

One favourable time for entry into Australia would have been 70,000 years ago. The smallest gap at any time between islands is 90 km.

Not according to the maps at THIS LINK.

That can happen when you quote from your own book. Perhaps you should list your source (other than yourself, that is,) next time.

Harte

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Harte
He did his best with what info he had available... Imagine what he could have added if he had the internet at his disposal!!!!

"Did his best" to pull the wool over unsuspecting eyes such as yours, as THIS LINK clearly shows.

And Fell died in 1994. He did have the internet, though he was probably too old by then to truly scam people that particular way.

Harte

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darkbreed

I dont have a referance, but Im pretty sure I've read from some scientifical papers of some guys who've doen research figured out the "hieroglyphs" where much more modern and probably carved by some jolly tourists to create a sensation.

Thats my two cents.

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wtwt5237

Is there any theory explaining how the world wide prehistory culture broke down? If people could exchange information then across continents, why in thousands of years to come did we lose this ability?

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crystal sage
Is there any theory explaining how the world wide prehistory culture broke down? If people could exchange information then across continents, why in thousands of years to come did we lose this ability?

:innocent: ... maybe nuclear???

http://s8int.com/atomic2.html

http://www.thothweb.com/article-print-4150.html

Edited by crystal sage

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crystal sage
I did read a lot from that link, and found it extremely wanting.

The artifacts you're talking about are merely listed there, without any provenance, mostly. The few that had accompanying pictures didn't look at all Egyptian to me.

If you're gonna make a claim of Egyptians traveling to Australia based on a Ptolemaic coin, as the website does in one place, you should realize that the Ptolemaic kings of Egypt were Greek, not Egyptian. This was during Roman times as well. Yet nothing Greek, Roman or Egyptian remains to tell us of this feat? Please.

How can I be sure it's hogwash? I believe I already gave my reasons, the Egyptians were incapable of sailing that far. They bragged on and on about reaching the mouth of the Red Sea, for God's sake! How is it that they reached Australia (much less India, Madagascar, Indonesia, etc.) and never left one single indication of it at home or abroad, yet there's all sorts of paintings and carvings memorializing several different voyages to Punt, just down the coast?

Regarding the Aborigines walking to Australia, you might be right. The absence of Asian animals, though possibly explained by their being outcompeted by native animals, is nevertheless a strong argument.

I don't pretend to know exactly how much land on the Indo-Australian plate was above water at the time. But it's a cinch that it was no great sailing voyage. This is because of the Ice Age at the time and the amount of water that was locked up in the ice.

You have an extremely odd and out of touch idea of what constitutes a civilization. Either that or you thought I meant "culture" when I said "civilization."

Not according to the maps at THIS LINK.

That can happen when you quote from your own book. Perhaps you should list your source (other than yourself, that is,) next time.

Harte

There was a world wide pyramid culture... B) each added their own cultural flavour to it!!!! eg like all architechs.... artists....

http://www.world-mysteries.com/aa_3.htm

Edited by crystal sage

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The Puzzler
I did read a lot from that link, and found it extremely wanting.

The artifacts you're talking about are merely listed there, without any provenance, mostly. The few that had accompanying pictures didn't look at all Egyptian to me.

If you're gonna make a claim of Egyptians traveling to Australia based on a Ptolemaic coin, as the website does in one place, you should realize that the Ptolemaic kings of Egypt were Greek, not Egyptian. This was during Roman times as well. Yet nothing Greek, Roman or Egyptian remains to tell us of this feat? Please.

How can I be sure it's hogwash? I believe I already gave my reasons, the Egyptians were incapable of sailing that far. They bragged on and on about reaching the mouth of the Red Sea, for God's sake! How is it that they reached Australia (much less India, Madagascar, Indonesia, etc.) and never left one single indication of it at home or abroad, yet there's all sorts of paintings and carvings memorializing several different voyages to Punt, just down the coast?

Regarding the Aborigines walking to Australia, you might be right. The absence of Asian animals, though possibly explained by their being outcompeted by native animals, is nevertheless a strong argument.

I don't pretend to know exactly how much land on the Indo-Australian plate was above water at the time. But it's a cinch that it was no great sailing voyage. This is because of the Ice Age at the time and the amount of water that was locked up in the ice.

You have an extremely odd and out of touch idea of what constitutes a civilization. Either that or you thought I meant "culture" when I said "civilization."

Not according to the maps at THIS LINK.

That can happen when you quote from your own book. Perhaps you should list your source (other than yourself, that is,) next time.

Harte

I'm not saying it based on one coin but many other things listed there and information I have been reading. I told you also my theory about them not sailing to Australia but making the journey by land helped across waters by natives. They have left indication abroad, this is the things being found here, just because it is not immortilised in their culture does not mean some explorers couldn't have journeyed farther than Punt. I would assume they did not make it back so how could they record it? I'd also assume therefore that Egyptians in Egypt did not even know about Australia. Yes I'm assuming but I am trying to look outside the square. This is going no where, you obviously have your opinion and don't want to open your eyes to anything but what you have been told or read, sorry but I'm not like that, I believe there is much we modern people don't know yet about ancient civilisations and will not take things at face value based on what you think is fact. I am here at Unexplained Mysteries because some things are UNexplained. I came up with this thread after hearing a story about the Aborigines of Australia not being the actual culture that arrived here, that negroid pygmies also inhabited Australia before the arrival of the Aboriginals we know today.

Also I did not write the book I sourced, it is a book I own, titled Archaeology of the Dreamtime, the Story of Prehistoric Australia and it's People by Josephine Flood, I listed my source and I'm pretty sure they know alot about the Aboriginal history including details about how and when crossing the sea occured, Ice age water levels and how they reached these conclusions. OK you have said you don't think Egyptians made it to Australia, well I do think they made it here in one form or another and I am not going to take your opinion as fact, sorry. If I did that I would have been converted to religion by now too. Just because Joe Blow says so and thinks they have the facts does not make me believe it.

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Harte
I dont have a referance, but Im pretty sure I've read from some scientifical papers of some guys who've doen research figured out the "hieroglyphs" where much more modern and probably carved by some jolly tourists to create a sensation.

Thats my two cents.

Darkbreed,

Every now and then you exhibit a modicum of rationality, which is why I like you. I don't hold your "Atlantean" leanings against you, for I once felt the same way.

At least you have both feet on the ground, most of the time anyway! :w00t:

Harte

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jaylemurph
There was a world wide pyramid culture... B) each added their own cultural flavour to it!!!! eg like all architechs.... artists....

http://www.world-mysteries.com/aa_3.htm

Or...

Pyramids are very basic architectural shapes and, as a basic form, were seized upon by several different cultures...

No need to re-write history, no need to postulate cultures with no evidence.

--Jaylemurph

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Harte
...I am not going to take your opinion as fact, sorry. If I did that I would have been converted to religion by now too. Just because Joe Blow says so and thinks they have the facts does not make me believe it.

Pretty much sums up how I feel about this ridiculous idea as well.

See, I've actually taken the time to learn enough about the ancient Egyptians to come to an educated opinion on this rather uneducated subject. Not being a teacher, and not having the necessary time even if I was, I don't care to bring you up to date on the Egyptians and what they were and were not capable of.

If you continue to research it yourself, and if you can keep an open mind about it, I'm confident that you will eventually come to the same conclusion regarding this that I have come to. So why waste my time? You'll figure it out yourself, eventually, or you won't. If you don't it'll be because you don't want to.

Harte

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crystal sage
Or...

Pyramids are very basic architectural shapes and, as a basic form, were seized upon by several different cultures...

No need to re-write history, no need to postulate cultures with no evidence.

--Jaylemurph

Or more of the case of 'keeping up with the Jones's' ....a fashion thing.,...

=There is more than enough evidence of trade connections..mining opperations... spaning at least 7,000 years... too .. http://www.carantha.net/forum_veneti_part_i.htm

Archaeologists have discovered Europe's oldest civilisation, a network of dozens of temples, 2,000 years older than Stonehenge and the Pyramids. More than 150 gigantic monuments have been located beneath the fields and cities of modern-day Germany, Austria and Slovakia. They were built 7,000 years ago, between 4800 BC and 4600 BC. Their discovery, revealed today by The Independent, will revolutionise the study of prehistoric Europe, where an appetite for monumental architecture was thought to have developed later than in Mesopotamia and Egypt.

In all, more than 150 temples have been identified. Constructed of earth and wood, they had ramparts and palisades that stretched for up to half a mile. They were built by a religious people who lived in communal longhouses up to 50 metres long, grouped around substantial villages. Evidence suggests.

Their civilisation seems to have died out after about 200 years and the recent archaeological discoveries are so new that the temple building culture does not even have a name yet. Excavations have been taking place over the past few years - and have triggered a re-evaluation of similar, though hitherto mostly undated, complexes identified from aerial photographs throughout central Europe.

Archaeologists are now beginning to suspect that hundreds of these very early monumental religious centres, each up to 150 metres across, were constructed across a 400-mile swath of land in what is now Austria, the Czech Republic, Slovakia, and eastern Germany. The most complex excavated so far - located inside the city of Dresden - consisted of an apparently sacred internal space surrounded by two palisades, three earthen banks and four ditches. http://www.trakiiskata-atlantida.hit.bg/english.htm

.

and I wouldn't doubt that the cultural idea that still goes on today.. of the 'heir apparant' eg like the present British Royal family... that the sons.. would have had some educational on thejob training by seeing the world.. travelling with the armies.. or merchants...to learn how to manage their men... how business ..trade... tithes...ruling...their countries... visiting and introducing themselves to other heads of nations... lands...works...leaving little diplomatic core groups around all over the world ... like we do now. having little embassies all over the world... that take care of our interests...act as mediation....... they would have seen the wonders of other lands... eg Egypt..China..Syria.. Europe...etc... and said... I like that.. lets build one too when we get back!!!!! they could have hired some architects.. builders from these lands... and taken them home!!!! Just like we do now!!!

Edited by crystal sage

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The Puzzler

Thanks so much Crystal Sage for the many links and information you are providing to help us in our quest to understand more about this topic, I for one am very grateful for your support. Hopefully some people are taking the time to read them and getting an idea how this 'crazy notion' could be true. The more I search the more I am finding also and I refuse to just brush it under the table.

Harte, the only thing I can see you are basing your whole non belief of this theory on is that you think Egyptians did not sail beyond Punt. I really think you should open your eyes a bit more on this but if you don't want to then that's fine with me. I don't want to waste your time.

In one website I was just on it says this among other things: "Chemical analysis of some Ancient Egyptian Mummies has revealed the presence of Eucalyptus Oil – which indicates contact with Australia in the days of the Pharaohs!" I have been in so many I am not actually sure which one that was but will source it when I find it again. Anyways regardless of what anyone thinks the "apparent" evidence is there and I for one am having a good read and learning experience reading it all. Thanks to everyone so far who has contributed to my thread.

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The Puzzler

The following is extracted from an article by Glenville Pyke taken from a book by Gilbert Deem titled "Ancient and Mysterious Discoveries in Australia":

'near Toowoomba, a group of seventeen granite stones were found with Phoenician inscriptions. One has been translated to read "Guard the shrine of Yahweh's message"and "God of Gods". Another inscription reads "Assemble here to worship the sun". Mr. Gilroy has an ironstone slab found by a man from Cooktown in Far North Queensland years ago, which bears a Phoenician inscription, "The Eye of Ra the sun rules Sinim". Sinim was a mysterious southern continent, mentioned in the Old Testament. The Phoenician name for it was Ofir, a "great south land of gold", where gold was obtained to build Solomon's temple. The Egyptians called it "the land of Punt". A large ironstone slab in Mr. Gilroy's museum at Tamworth, was unearthed by a Rockhampton area farmer some years ago, and bears another Phoenician inscription that reads:"Ships sail from this land under the protection of Yahweh [Yahweh was not known as a god by the Hebrews only but was a Phoenician god as well]..." Mr. Gilroy says that it "may very well be that minerals and precious stones came from Australia...". He points out that "black opals found in archaeological digs in Egypt, could only have come from Australia".'

The Gympie region in Queensland sustains a pyramid with Phoenician scripts on it and a Toth-figurine clutching on the Tau [the cross of life].. The region revealed other mystery megalithic structures and remains of pre-European gold, copper and tin mining operations. An ancient harbour, long dried up, extended inland from Tin Can Bay to the Gympie district, and ancient Aboriginal traditions spoke of fair-skinned 'culture-heroes' having sailed into Gympie in big canoes shaped like birds [Phoenician triremes with sails and bird-headed prows?]. They built a "sacred mountain" [the Gympie stepped-pyramid] from which they worshipped the Sun and stars. They "dug holes in the hills, then sailed away with the rocks they had dug up, promising to return".

Recently, Mr. Gilroy has released a book titled "Pyramids in the Pacific" containing a history of ancient mining operations throughout Australasia. Described in full are a number of what he believes are the remains of Middle-Eastern mining colonies, established across Australia, where copper and tin [needed to manufacture bronze] was mined, as well other precious metals and gemstones. Some of these colonies were established deep inland on the shores of coastal rivers, such as one Queensland site on the Bremer river [which flows into the Brisbane River] east of Toowoomba. Here he unearthed along with his wife more than 50 stone slabs bearing Bronze Age Phoenician...inscriptions. A similar number, recovered at a site outside Moree, in northern NSW were found near the remains of a megalithic ruin. Here upon an altar stone he found the Phoenician inscription "Temple of Tanit". Tanit was the Phoenician earth-mother Goddess.

Rex Gilroy argues that ancient Middle-Eastern explorer-colonists, having found the mouth of the Murray River in southeastern South Australia, explored deep into the NSW interior via the adjoining Darling River as far as Dubbo and Basthurst, explaining Phoenician rock scripts found in these areas; and sailed into the Namoi-Peel River system as far as the Tamworth-Nundle district, leaving the mass of inscribed stones and pre-European open-cut mining sites found hereabouts. These mining colonies were large enough to warrant the establishment of local ruling classes, as shown by the many Phoenician and other rock inscriptions referring to various local monarchs. This theory would explain why central, far western and northern NSW is literally 'riddled' with rock scripts in a host of ancient Middle, Near-Eastern and other tongues.

Near the mouth of the Hawkesbury River over a dozen of human figures reminiscent of ancient Middle-Eastern seafarers were found carved into rock shelves. Near Wisemans Ferry is a carving of a ship with tall mast, sail and bird-headed row. Further downriver at Richmond a farmer had uncovered two large sandstone lumps of human heads resembling Mithras and Demeter [baal Hammon and Tanit!]. Near Gosford, Mr.Gilroy unearthed two stones inscribed in Iberian Phoenician inscriptions. These state:

"In this harbour* ships lie at anchor, gathered for Baal".

[*Brisbane Waters, at the mouth of the Hawkesbury River]

"The priest Ra-wa performs rituals at the shrine of the western [setting] sun."

It appears the inhabitants explored deep inland up the Hawkesbury-Nepean Rivers, venturing across the Blue Mountains as far as Katoomba, where several Phoenician inscriptions were found near the Megalong Valley.

Phoenicians must have penetrated the Georges River, south of Sydney, to leave the three inscribed stones recovered recently at a Lansvale riverbank site; and at Campbelltown further south, in 1970 Mr. Gilroy recovered a sandstone slab bearing the image of a seated, animal-headed figure [which appears to depict Baal, the Phoenician Sun-God] on one side, and on the other the Iberio-Phoenician inscriptions:

"The Sun, the divine King.

Baal the Sun rules.

He the waters of this land rules."

Further south, outside Bowral, near a megalithic ruin, the possible remains of an ancient temple, a large stone bearing the following inscription was discovered:

"To Phoenician Baal this shrine is dedicated by Hu.

We are sailors from Ham who worship the sun."

Nearby the Gilroys found another inscription; written in Phoenician:

"Bel, God of the Sun, on the prepared

land assemble

at his shrine before his stone.

On Beltain*, on Ludd's altar stone

sacrifice to him.

The pleasing son of Mabo sails the Sunship".

[*feast of Beltain - May Day

Various axes, swords, jars, scarabs, rock art along with Aboriginal dreamtime from the Kimberley support the hypotheses that the Phoenicians had reached Australia. Further more they had established long-term colonies and mining operations and intermarried with the Aborigines producing "spirit-children" as the Wandjina tales sustains. If all these accounts can be confirmed then history will be rewritten, if not, then we would have exercised our imagination with a beautiful story.

This information comes from the website: http:/phoenicia.org/australia.html

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jaylemurph
Or more of the case of 'keeping up with the Jones's' ....a fashion thing.,...

=There is more than enough evidence of trade connections..mining opperations... spaning at least 7,000 years... too .. http://www.carantha.net/forum_veneti_part_i.htm

and I wouldn't doubt that the cultural idea that still goes on today.. of the 'heir apparant' eg like the present British Royal family... that the sons.. would have had some educational on thejob training by seeing the world.. travelling with the armies.. or merchants...to learn how to manage their men... how business ..trade... tithes...ruling...their countries... visiting and introducing themselves to other heads of nations... lands...works...leaving little diplomatic core groups around all over the world ... like we do now. having little embassies all over the world... that take care of our interests...act as mediation....... they would have seen the wonders of other lands... eg Egypt..China..Syria.. Europe...etc... and said... I like that.. lets build one too when we get back!!!!! they could have hired some architects.. builders from these lands... and taken them home!!!! Just like we do now!!!

Well... evidence of some unknown, global culture -- or even ancient intercontinental contact -- is spurious at best, an out-and-out fabrication at worst.

--Jaylemurph

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The Puzzler

After just being on a website with Unusual Anomolies I can only agree with the last sentence here and I suggest everyone else do the same: (unless of course you think they are all fake).

Humans were not even around 65 million years ago, never mind people who could work metal. So then how does science explain semi-ovoid metallic tubes dug out of 65-million-year-old Cretaceous chalk in France? In 1885, a block of coal was broken open to find a metal cube obviously worked by intelligent hands. In 1912, employees at an electric plant broke apart a large chunk of coal out of which fell an iron pot! A nail was found embedded in a sandstone block from the Mesozoic Era. And there are many, many more such anomalies.

What are we to make of these finds? There are several possibilities:

Intelligent humans date back much, much further than we realize.

Other intelligent beings and civilizations existed on earth far beyond our recorded history.

Our dating methods are completely inaccurate, and that stone, coal and fossils form much more rapidly than we now estimate.

In any case, these examples - and there are many more - should prompt any curious and open-minded scientist to reexamine and rethink the true history of life on earth.

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The Puzzler

And just in case you think that Egyptians couldn't make it to Australia, seems they made it to many places around the world.

The Far-Traveling Egyptians

Statues: In 1914, archaeologist M.A. Gonzales was excavating some Mayan ruins in the city of Acajutla, Mexico when he was surprised by the discovery of two statuettes that were clearly Egyptian. One male and one female, the carvings bore ancient Egyptian dress and cartouches. They are thought to depict Osiis and Isis.

Inscriptions: Ancient Egyptian hieroglyphs have been found in New South Wales, Australia. Located on a rock cliff in the National Park forest of the Hunter Valley, north of Sydney, the enigmatic carvings have been known since the early 1900s. There are more than 250 carvings of familiar Egyptian gods and symbols, including a life-sized engraving of the god Anubis. The hieroglyphs tell the story of explorers who were shipwrecked in a strange and hostile land, and the untimely death of their royal leader, "Lord Djes-eb." From this information, scholars have been able to date the voyage to somewhere between 1779 and 2748 BC.

Fossils: In 1982, archaeologists digging at Fayum, near the Siwa Oasis in Egypt uncovered fossils of kangaroos and other Australian marsupials.

Language: There are striking similarities between the languages of ancient Egypt and those of the Native Americans that inhabited the areas around Louisiana about the time of Christ. B. Fell, of the Epigraphic Society, has stated that the language of the Atakapas, and to a lesser extent those of the Tunica and Chitimacha tribes, have affinities with Nile Valley languages involving just those words one would associate with Egyptian trading communities of 2,000 years ago.

Artifacts: Near the Neapean River outside Penrith, New South Wales, a scarab beetle - a familair Egyptian symbol - carved from onyx was unearthed. Another was found in Queensland, Australia.

Tombs: The April 5, 1909 edition of The Phoenix Gazette carried a front-page article about the discovery and excavation of an Egyptian tomb in the Grand Canyon by none other that the Smithsonian. The Smithsonian has since denied knowledge of any such discovery.

More on the Grand Canyon tomb: http://paranormal.about.com/gi/dynamic/off...345/Canyon.html

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crystal sage
Well... evidence of some unknown, global culture -- or even ancient intercontinental contact -- is spurious at best, an out-and-out fabrication at worst.

--Jaylemurph

Here's another one....

http://www.iran-daily.com/1383/2131/html/art.htm

6,000 Year-Old City Unearthed in Qom

TEHRAN, Nov. 3--The largest old city has been unearthed in Qom. It is 6,000-year old and sprawls over an area of 50 hectares.

The head of the excavation team Siamak Sarlak told IRNA that chimneys for ironworks as well as statues and designs carved on stones indicated a relatively urban lifestyle led by the people in the city.

He said that in the second period of excavation at Qala (fortress) Dervish, a large area belonging to the first and second Iron Ages dating back to 1000-2000 BC were discovered. "Studies on the excavations indicated that the people living in that period led an urban life as against the nomadic life," he said.

The excavations, he noted, now aim to unearth the graveyard of the 6,000-year old city, but the cemeteries unearthed so far belonged to the 19th century Qajar era.

He complained that the area of the old city has been ruined and that only 10 hectares of the 50 hectares old city has remained untouched.

He said that the construction of an overpass in the area has led to the destruction of the historical site located on Qom-Jamkaran road. Archeologists first identified the historical city 14 years ago.

http://www.stonepages.com/news/archives/001993.html

http://dmoz.org/Science/Social_Sciences/Ar...ddle_East/Iran/

Human Settlement in Iran’s Central Plateau Dates back to 10,000 Years Ago

http://www.payvand.com/news/05/mar/1070.html

Tehran, Mar. 7 (Iranian Cultural Heritage News Agency) -- Farmers activities in Togh Tepe of Mazandaran province, resulted in the accidental discovery of the oldest pottery ever found in the area. Studies carried out on the artifacts have shown that humans have lived in the central plateau of Iran since 9 or 10 thousand years ago.

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crystal sage

http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200211/2...21_107216.shtml

Last updated at: (Beijing Time) Thursday, November 21, 2002

China's Boat-building Dates Back 7,500 Years: Archaeologists

Chinese archaeologists have unearthed a wooden boat dating back at least 7,500 years in Xiaoshan City of east China's Zhejiang Province. It is the most ancient boat ever discovered in China.

http://discovermagazine.com/1998/apr/newwomenoftheice1430

on pre-Ice age weaving methods for hunting etc.....

New Women of the Ice Age

Forget about hapless mates being dragged around by macho mammoth killers. The women of Ice Age Europe, it appears, were not mere cavewives but priestly leaders, clever inventors, and mighty hunters.

by Heather Pringle

The black venus of dolni Ve vstonice, a small, splintered figurine sensuously fashioned from clay, is an envoy from a forgotten world. It is all soft curves, with breasts like giant pillows beneath a masked face. At nearly 26,000 years old, it ranks among the oldest known portrayals of women, and to generations of researchers, it has served as a powerful—if enigmatic—clue to the sexual politics of the Ice Age.

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crystal sage

:tu: ooops ... and!!!!

http://www.nyu.edu/nyutoday/archives/14/04/egypt.nyu

World's oldest built boats deliver new information about Egypt's earliest civilization

November 16, 2000

A fleet of the oldest built wooden boats in the world, located in the desert sands of Abydos, Egypt -- more than eight miles from the river Nile -- are painstakingly being excavated by archaeologists and with them remarkable new evidence about the wealth, power, and technological prowess of the earliest days of Egyptian civilization. The work is being conducted under the authority of Egypt's Minister of Culture, Dr. Farouk Hosni, and the Secretary General of the Supreme Council of Antiquities, Dr. Gaballa Ali Gaballa.

To date, 14 of the large vessels, dating from 3000 B.C. and estimated to be between 60 and 80 feet long, have been identified and a large section of one boat has been exposed, conserved, and studied by a team of archeologists from the University of Pennsylvania Museum, Yale University, and the Institute of Fine Arts at New York University working under permit from Egypt's Supreme Council of Antiquities. The conservation component of the Abydos Boats project is financed by the Egyptian Antiquities Project of the American Research Center in Egypt, under its grant from the United States Agency for International Development.

Dr. David O'Connor, the Lila Acheson Wallace Professor of Egyptian Art and Archaeology at NYU's Institute of Fine Arts and curator emeritus and research associate, Egyptian Section, University of Pennsylvania Museum, has been working at Abydos since 1967. He is project director for the Abydos Boats project and co-director, with Dr. William Kelly Simpson of Yale University, of the long-running multi-faceted Abydos Expedition.

"Ancient Egypt is a riverine civilization, yet before these boats were discovered we knew very little - beyond representations on ancient pots - about ancient Egyptian boats earlier than the reign of Khufu, one of the greatest fourth dynasty pharaohs," said Dr. O'Connor. "These boats provide us with a window into better understanding Egypt at the dawn of its extraordinary, long-lived civilization. Moreover, recent excavations have confirmed our original guess. These boat graves contain actual and viable boats intended for a king's use in the afterlife. They are in meaning and function the direct ancestors of the famous boat recovered at Khufu's Great Pyramid at Giza and predate Khufu's boat by perhaps as much as 300 years."

The Abydos archaeologists knew as early as 1991 that at least a dozen boat graves existed adjacent to a massive funerary enclosure for the late Dynasty II (ca. 2675 B.C.) Pharaoh Khasekhemwy. During the May/June 2000 excavation season, a team that included expert conservators and an ancient boat specialist was able to establish that the boats were placed in their graves many years before Khasekhemwy's funerary enclosure was built - so that they were intended for the afterlife of a much earlier dynastic ruler, perhaps even Aha, the first Dynasty I (ca. 2920-2770) ruler of Egypt.

While precise dating through carbon 14 testing (only accurate to about 200 years) remains to be determined, early excavation of a 10-foot portion of one of the wooden hulls has already yielded surprising results: the archaeologists now believe the boats were not models, as many mortuary-associated objects could be, but viable vessels which could accommodate as many as 30 rowers.

http://technocrat.net/d/2006/3/23/1555

# Researchers have the remains of wooden ship timbers and other evidence of advanced trade and travel going back 4000 years in a cave in Egypt. They describe the site as a "mothballed military base".

# news release from Florida State:

"The oldest remains of seafaring ships in the world have been found in caves at the edge of the Egyptian desert along with cargo boxes that suggest ancient Egyptians sailed nearly 1,000 miles on rough waters to get treasures from a place they called God's Land, or Punt.

Florida State University anthropology professor Cheryl Ward has determined that wooden planks found in the manmade caves are about 4,000 years old - making them the world's most ancient ship timbers. Shipworms that had tunneled into the planks indicated the ships had weathered a long voyage of a few months, likely to the fabled southern Red Sea trading center of Punt, a place referenced in hieroglyphics on empty cargo boxes found in the caves, Ward said.

The team also found a stela, or limestone tablet, of Pharaoh Amenemhat III, who ruled between 1844-1797 B.C., inscribed with all five of his royal names. The plaque provided further evidence that discoveries found at the site date to Egypt's Middle Kingdom period. A period of civil unrest and political instability likely put a halt to further exploration, Ward said, and the Wadi Gawasis site was long forgotten.

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/2006-...hot-notes_x.htm

Edited by crystal sage

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crystal sage

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/summary/296/5574/1791

ARCHAEOLOGY:

Report of Oldest Boat Hints at Early Trade Routes

Andrew Lawler

LONDON--A Kuwaiti site has yielded 7000-year-old bitumen slabs thought to be from a seafaring vessel. If the interpretation of the material is correct, the discovery pushes back physical evidence of boats by more than 2000 years and sheds light on what later became trading routes linking two ancient civilizations: those of the Indus River valley and Mesopotamia. A second team is finishing a controversial reconstruction of a younger ship found in Oman.

ment the sparse archaeological evidence. For. example, Sumerian writings refer to ships. capable of hauling 18 tons of cargo to and. from Oman. ...

http://www.subversiveelement.com/History_A...roglyphics.html .....these people from far away lands came here to gather Gold. Some of the races that visited were most commonly the Aztecs and Egyptians. In Brett Green's books, the Aboriginals would speak of ships with "heart beats", this would of course refer to banging of the drums as each stroke of the paddles struck the water. They told of "sails", in their own words and also of the armor worn by some of the strangers who arrived from these ships.

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