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The Puzzler

Egyptian evidence in Australia

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crystal sage
so what youre saying is

that Australia has been isolated for about 295.6 billion years longer than the earth has been in existence

laughable

If you look at the hybridized map of the world you can still see that it isn't too hard to get to..

http://maps.google.com/maps?um=1&tab=w...p;q=world%20map

We are still finding Eastern refugees on our shores...who managed the trip in tiny little boats... also there is still a lot of illegal fishing going on here by the same... some in very primitive boats...

http://www.abc.net.au/xmlcontent/imode/1920065.xml

http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/425822/70656

Edited by crystal sage

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apollyon
If you look at the hybridized map of the world you can still see that it isn't too hard to get to..

http://maps.google.com/maps?um=1&tab=w...p;q=world%20map

We are still finding Eastern refugees on our shores...who managed the trip in tiny little boats... also there is still a lot of illegal fishing going on here by the same... some in very primitive boats...

http://www.abc.net.au/xmlcontent/imode/1920065.xml

http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/425822/70656

hmmm

how did western civilisation start in Australia ?

:w00t:

they didn't walk there either if i recall correctly

anyway

Sahul is the name given to the single Pleistocene-era continent which combined Australia with New Guinea and Tasmania. At the time, the sea level was as much as 150 meters lower than it is today; and it was separated from the other great land mass (Sunda) by the Sahul Strait. The island in the photograph would have been part of Sahul.

Archaeologists care about this ancient continental shift because to get the Sahul populated, people had to actively work at getting there from the Sunda (in other words, they had to have boats or rafts and were likely to intend getting there).Currently, there are two theories about when this happened: 60,000 or 40,000 years ago. Scholars do agree that there are sites in Australia that date to at least 40,000 years ago, including Devil's Lair, Lake Mungo, Nauwalabila, and Malakunanja.

http://archaeology.about.com/od/humanorigi...ralia_popul.htm

linked-image

Edited by apollyon

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crystal sage
hmmm

how did western civilisation start in Australia ?

:w00t:

they didn't walk there either if i recall correctly

anyway

http://archaeology.about.com/od/humanorigi...ralia_popul.htm

linked-image

I read that they did walk there... The Aboriginals are great walkers....

http://www.unknowncountry.com/news/?id=2997

Prehistoric art in Australia that is invisible to the naked eye is being discovered by digital cameras and image-enhancing computers. Archeologists take pictures of blank walls and enhance them, and ancient images magically appear.

Archeologist Bruno David says, "Sometimes you can see a trace of something, but even when a painting has faded completely from view, the colors have gone into the rock. With image enhancement, we can separate out those colors from the gray of the rock and transpose them with ones that our own eyes and brains are more sensitive to. Suddenly we can see what was invisible before."

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apollyon
I read that they did walk there... The Aboriginals are great walkers....

great walkers they may be

but they're also pretty short

that doesn't bode well when youre walking on the bottom of a sea does it

its been established that ships and boationg go back a lot longer than we have evidence for, otherwise lots of racial groups on isolated islands around the world must have flown there.

the oldest rock art picture of a boat on earth is aboriginal from Australia

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crystal sage
great walkers they may be

but they're also pretty short

that doesn't bode well when youre walking on the bottom of a sea does it

its been established that ships and boationg go back a lot longer than we have evidence for, otherwise lots of racial groups on isolated islands around the world must have flown there.

the oldest rock art picture of a boat on earth is aboriginal from Australia

with boat part of the way... but mainly walking it think... if you look at the hybrid satellite picture you could see that when the sea level was lower how all the land masses could have been more connected... leaving a snake like landmass trail.....from Asia and many other places

http://maps.google.com/maps?um=1&tab=w...0to%20australia

http://www.crystalinks.com/dreamtime.html

Edited by crystal sage

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apollyon
with boat part of the way... but mainly walking it think... if you look at the hybrid satellite picture you could see that when the sea level was lower how all the land masses could have been more connected... leaving a snake like landmass trail.....from Asia and many other places

http://maps.google.com/maps?um=1&tab=w...0to%20australia

http://www.crystalinks.com/dreamtime.html

can't but help think youre missing the point here

that the Aboriginals walk everywhere today is more to do with them not inventing the internal combustion engine in the last 40,000 years

for them to get to the places that you are claiming they could have walked from they would have needed to use boats

furthermore to get to the place before that they would have needed to use boats

and it goes on

to get to that point they would have needed to use boats

add this to the fact that they themselves say they use boats and the fact that there is rockart pictures by them of boats all over australia and I can't see why insisting they walked all the way to Oz is even relevant

;)

oh btw your hybrid map isnt working properly and crystallink is not a valid source on anything

Edited by apollyon

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greggK
so what youre saying is

that Australia has been isolated for about 295.6 billion years longer than the earth has been in existence

laughable

Austraralia has been around for 295.6 billion more years than you think it has. :D

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apollyon
Austraralia has been around for 295.6 billion more years than you think it has. :D

where is this "Austraralia" that you speak of ?

:D

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louie

i thought it was covered that some university students had made the Australian glyphs, and it was all a hoax.

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Harte
http://www.laputanlogic.com/images/2006/01...113G058K500.jpg

http://www.prep.mcneese.edu/engr/engr321/preis/pirimap3.jpg

http://www.vintage-map.com/en/Maps/World-M...-1690::161.html

and then there is Homann, World Map, 1720

Cartograph / Printer: Homann, Johann Baptist (1663-1724)

http://www.vintage-map.com/en/Maps/World-M...p-1720::69.html

clearly shows Australia....

... B) by the way just because you can't find some supporting information... it doesn't make it a lie..... When someone's idea contradicts mine...I use it as a learning experience... I look deeper .. look at different scenarios, to see how and why they came to that conclusion...I am often surprised by what additional interesting info I pick up during these explorations... :D

http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Map

Thanks alot for those links Crystal Sage. They just strengthen my argument against educated guesswork put forward by uneducated skeptics.

Look at the moon - its been winking at me....again. ;)

Carlin Stalin

Here's the statement I made:

Flat-out falsehood. There is no "old map" predating the European colonization of Australia that even shows the continent, much less identifies it as Ophir.

The above maps do nothing to refute it. They do not show the continent of Australia. And as I said, they are all European, and all post date the first European contact, made by the Dutch in 1606.

In early 1606 Janszoon encountered and then charted the shores of Australia's Cape York Peninsula. The ship made landfall at the Pennefather River in the Gulf of Carpentaria. This was the first authenticated landing on Australian soil and for the first time all the inhabited continents of the world were known to the European science of geography. Janszoon is thus credited with the first authenticated European discovery of Australia.

Source - Wiki

Despite the above, it wasn't until Cook came along that any Europeans understood the actual extent of the island continent. This is why you only see western Australia in these maps, and not even all of that.

Anyone here still want to argue that Australia was actually Ophir? Or are you going to nit pick worse than me over when the Europeans started drawing Australia on maps and whether or not what was drawn actually constitutes a continent?

There is not a single whit of evidence that any ancient culture ever even heard of Australia (except, of course, the Aboriginal culture of Australia itself.)

Harte

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crystal sage
Here's the statement I made:

The above maps do nothing to refute it. They do not show the continent of Australia. And as I said, they are all European, and all post date the first European contact, made by the Dutch in 1606.

Source - Wiki

Despite the above, it wasn't until Cook came along that any Europeans understood the actual extent of the island continent. This is why you only see western Australia in these maps, and not even all of that.

Anyone here still want to argue that Australia was actually Ophir? Or are you going to nit pick worse than me over when the Europeans started drawing Australia on maps and whether or not what was drawn actually constitutes a continent?

There is not a single whit of evidence that any ancient culture ever even heard of Australia (except, of course, the Aboriginal culture of Australia itself.)

Harte

http://www.lib.cam.ac.uk/exhibitions/Fantasy_to_Federation/

http://gutenberg.net.au/aust-discovery.html

http://www.australiaonthemap.org.au/

"As the organisation formed to promote the 400 year anniversary of mapping Australia—Australia on the Map 1606-2006—winds up, a new AHS region has been formed to promote the history of mapping and hydrography."

http://mailman.geo.uu.nl/pipermail/maphist...ril/007232.html

"Further, a map of Paolo Forlani from 1560-1570's (forgot the exact date

now...maybe earlier) shows a better longitude placed North coast of

what clearly can be Australia, or at least with a more acceptable close

coastal configuration...you have there the Carpentaria Gulf, etc.

But again - we are stuck in putative Portuguese secret discovery of

Australia. And again Cornelius de Jode + Wytfliet references to a land

south of New Guinea, across a small Strait, etc. - before the first

records of Dutch sightings...

Anyway if they would sail from Lisbon to Timor - being for almost 100

years in Timor before the first Dutch known records of Australia...do you

seriously believe Portuguese would not navigate a few extra-miles?...Being

stuck for 100 years just across the Timor Gap?...Obviously

not...obviously they were around...thus common sense must speak louder

sometimes also..."

Map 'proves' Portuguese discovered Australia

http://www.ausanthrop.net/phorum/read.php?1,1392,1394

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/stor...5001028,00.html

Edited by crystal sage

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crystal sage

http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=(1861)1%3...%3E2.0.CO%3B2-8

"AusAnthrop :: Discussion Forum and FAQ :: Map 'proves' Portuguese ...

... ships on a secret mission to discover Marco Polo's "Island of Gold" south of Java. ... He believes that this is the earliest known map of Australia. ...

Ptolemy's maps were regarded as authoritative until well into the 16th Century and considering the importance placed on his work, it was unfortunate that he had rejected the more accurate calculations of Eratosthenes. Ptolemy also discarded the correct theory that Africa was surrounded by water, and joined its east coast to the land-mass of Asia, turning the Indian Ocean into a vast lake. The southern shore of this lake was later designated Terra Australis Incognita, and belief in this mythical land persisted well into the 17th century.

http://www.rgssa.org.au/Maps.html

www.ausanthrop.net/phorum/read.php?1,1392,1394 - 32k - Cached - Similar pages"

http://members.iimetro.com.au/~hubbca/archaeology.htm

There are indications Egyptians inhabited the south

land thousands of years ago. Sumerian and Maya descriptions of a lost land in the ocean

have been found. On Crates' map of the world, Australia is named 'Antoecie' as on the Grek map by Eratosthenese in 239 BC. Scientists in the late

middle ages argued that there

must be a southern landmass to counterbalance the Northern known world. The discovery of

the America's had suggested their must be a landmass south of Euro-Asia, but until 400

years there was no proof.

http://www.ammerlaan.demon.nl/quadcentenary.htm

http://img367.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p...prome14784b.jpg

http://remotecentral.blogspot.com/2007/03/...t-discover.html

Scholars had long asked why part of one of the Vallard maps - featuring 120 place names in Portuguese, not French - closely resembled the coast of Queensland. But they had dismissed it as a coincidence, because the map suddenly jutted out at right angles for 1500 kilometres, bearing no relation to any known coastline.

However, once part of the map had been rotated 90 degrees..."the entire east coast of Australia, and part of the south coast as far as Kangaroo Island, was revealed in incredible detail."

What isn't revealed by this article is how King Manuel knew of the location in the first place in order to send this small flotilla on an exploratory voyage which may well have taken them into Botany Bay itself.

The reason given for the mystery of why no-one else was privy to the knowledge of a previously unknown continent is because the Portuguese wished to exploit the resources there for themselves, or at least prevent their European rivals from gaining access to them. http://remotecentral.blogspot.com/2007/03/...t-discover.html

Edited by crystal sage

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apollyon
Sumerian and Maya descriptions of a lost land in the ocean

have been found

this is extremely tenuous

the Sumerians called the land Dilmun and they never said it was in any particular direction

modern scholars believe they were talking about Bahrain

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dilmun

as for the Maya, there is no legend about a lost land at all

perhaps Mr Tom Vandervelt was slightly confused or just ignorant of the facts and was referring to Aztlan the legendary lost home of the Aztecs,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aztlan

do you really believe the Aztecs originated in Australia

seeing as Mr Vandervelt later goes on to regale us about Boomerangs found in Tutankhamens tomb i don't place him very high on the credibility list

n.b. Boomerangs in ancient times were used in India Africa and Europe, but were called throwing sticks or throwing knives.

this one is from Nubia

linked-image

this is the one from the tomb of Tut

linked-image

they were weapons used for hunting birds

;)

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crystal sage

I do recall reading a while ago... that from the aboriginal dreamtime..oral history... they say that when they first wandered into Australia there were others living there that that were eventually disposed of ... that there were many migrations over many years... which supposedly accounts for the 500 odd dialects they have...

there has been a lot of political back stepping lately... maybe because there are huge battles between Aboriginal rights... sacred grounds... and the government try to make up for stealing their children... their land... and using them for target practice in the old days.... so they are now searching the world...the museums.. for the 'stuffed Aboriginals' and bones.. they used for research purposes... and returning them to their tribes... they were thinking of doing further tests on them eg.. DNA... for research anthropological purposes... but things are getting a little edgy by the sounds of things.... Maybe if they prove there were other people living in Australia when the Aboriginals took over... they may lose some of their legal rights.. that they fought so hard for... as they would then seem no better or worse than the present 'owners' of the land...

http://www.jcu.edu.au/aff/history/articles/turnbull.htm

there also appears to be a link with the early Americans...

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/430944.stm

http://www.atlantisrising.com/issue18/18polynesians.html

The programme, Ancient Voices, shows that the dimensions of prehistoric skulls found in Brazil match those of the aboriginal peoples of Australia and Melanesia. Other evidence suggests that these first Americans were later massacred by invaders from Asia.....The skull dimensions and facial features match most closely the native people of Australia and Melanesia. These people date back to about 60,000 years, and were themselves descended from the first humans, who left Africa about 100,000 years ago. :tu: ( you're right they did use boats!!!!)Here, Grahame Walsh, an expert on Australian rock art, found the oldest painting of a boat anywhere in the world. The style of the art means it is at least 17,000 years old, but it could be up to 50,000 years old.

Hence tales of the lost land. Australia ..ancestors to early America Brazil... the knowledge of this land... that was lost in the myths of time....

if you look at the satelite map of Australia and Brazil the are quite close... you can also see the various depths of the oceans how if the water level were lower with the ice ages you can see how many of the lands would have connected.... or only required short boat trips...to get from one Island or land mass to another...

http://maps.google.com/maps?um=1&tab=w...land%20atlantis

Edited by crystal sage

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crystal sage
http://www.atlantisrising.com/issue18/18polynesians.html

Fell believed that the Polynesians were descended from Libyans in the service of Egypt, working as sailors to Egyptian gold mines in Sumatra, and even Australia and elsewhere. He also believes that many Melanesians are the descendants of Negro slaves used as workers in the gold mines. Fell even goes on to call the dialect used by the Zuni Indians of the American south-west as Mauri script and maintains that the Maoris may be related to the Zuni Indians and their "Mauri" language.

http://www.lost-civilizations.net/atlantis...e-1-page-8.html

http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0025-1496...STOR-reducePage

http://www.janesoceania.com/indonesia/index.htm

Edited by crystal sage

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chimeraddraig

India had a trading port at Oc Eo in Vietnam by the 1st cent., which supplied Chinese goods to the

Roman emporium in India. From India, the southern winds blow to Australia and it takes experience

to avoid hitting the place, as the Dutch "Batavia" ship-wreck shows. You need to throw a sharp left

to reach Sumatra. The Kimberley coast is where so much rock-art is found, with double-headed eagles

and the "Bradshaw" art with Zulu-style dancing warriors in leg-tassels and head plumes.

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apollyon
India had a trading port at Oc Eo in Vietnam by the 1st cent., which supplied Chinese goods to the

Roman emporium in India. From India, the southern winds blow to Australia and it takes experience

to avoid hitting the place,

uhuh

so if its so easy

why didn't it get found officially until the 16th century ?

:)

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chimeraddraig

"so if its so easy why didn't it get found officially until the 16th century ?"

Umm, the officials didn't come from Europe until then. The Macassan fishing fleets from Indonesia

went there ever year to supply the Chinese trepang market, but that was 100% of the exports from

Australia. The silly fishermen didn't come to murder and raise the imperial flag, like the Christian

officials.

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apollyon
"so if its so easy why didn't it get found officially until the 16th century ?"

Umm, the officials didn't come from Europe until then. The Macassan fishing fleets from Indonesia

went there ever year to supply the Chinese trepang market, but that was 100% of the exports from

Australia. The silly fishermen didn't come to murder and raise the imperial flag, like the Christian

officials.

excuse me

we English never murdered and then raised the flag

you have to raise the flag first then you can murder

you foreigners got no idea of etiquette have you

;)

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chimeraddraig

"you have to raise the flag first then you can murder

you foreigners got no idea of etiquette have you"

Eeeh, now, did not Henry VII raise flag and make all land part of Wales, look you? Otherwise, you

would never defeat Spain, eh? And just why was English colony in Australia named "New South

Wales"? You don't know! People there were Camaray, now a Sydney suburb, also spelt "Gamaray".

And it means "comrades", as Cymru /Gymru does. The hills look like south Wales.

How can that be, you ask? Why does "nghynbin" there mean "snakes", like "anghengfyn" in Cymric?

Well, now, did not Sanskrit Brahmins from Indian Cambodia go to Indonesia, and then to east

Australia by ship, in Bundjalung legend? ("Australian Dreaming" J Isaacs. Cam.)("Papers of Marjorie

Oakes"-Bundjalung.AIATSIS. Canberra).

Etiquette, the man says. Aboriginals have etiquette.

chimeraddraig

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woodwosa
I was doing some research on a rumour I had heard and came up with this web site. Has anyone ever heard of Egyptians in Australia before? What do you think of the evidence and apparent facts contained in this article? I myself was pretty amazed at it all. Even if the heiroglyphics seem fake I find it interesting that Aboriginals and Torres Strait Islanders have similar traditions to Egyptians and mummification processes as well as the Aten symbol. (Don't dismiss it because of the mention of the Gympie Pyramid idol)

http://www.crystalinks.com/egyptaustralia.html

i live in australia and a few years back,i traveled to a place called makay(spelling??)

i heard about an old stone warf or groin so i went and had alook and i found stones with L shaped deep carvings in them .

and some stones with holes in them .

it was very old ,you dont need a degree to see that

so i think yes it is true

anybody who lives here or is traveling here can see all this stuff for them selves

most are pretty accesable and in the open :yes:

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xCrimsonx

DREAMTIME is another link on that site , did ya read it WAAS?

Full on.

Ive heard a few elders talk about the stories of bright lights, etc. But not your local tale of the Min, Min lights either.

Central NT.

The picture of the spindally man from kakadu is said to have not been an Aboriginal man but a god of some sort.

Jabiru, Kakadu NT

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crystal sage
http://www.1421.tv/pages/evidence/content.asp?EvidenceID=472

Indeed, the amazing reach of ancient China’s globalization to Australia is evidenced by many pieces of broken Chinese ceramics dating from the Han dynasty (220 BC to 220 AD) to the early Ming (1368 to 1433) found on the eastern shore of the Gulf of Capentaria. But the clear evidence of Arab’s presence in North Australia during the Tang comes from Muhammad ibn Musa al-Khwarizimi’s 820 AD sea map of Java which showed the distinctive tip of the Cape York Peninsula and the U-shaped Carpentaria Gulf. Further evidence of Arab, Indian and Chinese traders during the Tang dynasty frequenting Australia long before any European arrivals is the AD 934 sea chart of Abu Al-Farisi Istakhari that clearly showed an outline of the northern coast of Australia. Clearly, any suggestion that before European arrivals, Australia’s history was a complete blank without any robust presence of the maritime traders from Asia is untrue.

http://www.asia-inc.com/novdec06/pdfs/colu...-3-novdec06.pdf

http://books.google.com/books?id=FD3Vsw8Jn...Hs1DIZUjSGOva9g

"Well," he hedged, "there is some evidence of ancient megalithic cultures in Australia. First of all, it appears that Australia was once inhabited by a race....

http://creationevolutiondesign.blogspot.co...eans-share.html

http://www.theaustralianyowieresearchcente..._legends_d.html

Throughout the length and breadth of central and far western New South wales,Aboriginal traditions speak of the Bulloo, or 'giant men and women', who they claim were 3m tall beings who wandered the land eating giant marsupials and other Australian ice-age 'megafauna' which they kiled with large stone clubs and other giant-size implements.

Further to the east, there dwelt the 'Jogungs' and 'Goolagahs', or 'giant hairy ones', tool making giant hominids sometimes confused with the Yowies, and who may, or may not have ben realted to the Bulloo.

http://www.beforeus.com/

Edited by crystal sage

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shantiel
I was doing some research on a rumour I had heard and came up with this web site. Has anyone ever heard of Egyptians in Australia before? What do you think of the evidence and apparent facts contained in this article? I myself was pretty amazed at it all. Even if the heiroglyphics seem fake I find it interesting that Aboriginals and Torres Strait Islanders have similar traditions to Egyptians and mummification processes as well as the Aten symbol. (Don't dismiss it because of the mention of the Gympie Pyramid idol)

http://www.crystalinks.com/egyptaustralia.html

Makes you wonder who actually started all the pyramids because they are all over the place

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sickpuppy
if it was real we would have heard about it by now.

that makes me laugh :)

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