Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
Sign in to follow this  
MaiTino

Belief and Faith are meaningless....

163 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

MaiTino

...in the eyes of God, Truth or whatever it is you refer it too.

Hellooooooooooooo,

Ok, just wanna throw this one in, these are my thoughts on the matter.

Belief and Faith are a tool to allow polite disreguard in discussion.....ignorance.

Belief and Faith are manefestations of the ego to give validation (when someone desires their point to be validated) to something that doesnt make sense in someone elses belief system (ego manefestation).

The context of Belief and Faith contradicts their purpose. Does God require people to believe in "him"? Surely Belief is only required when people have not had direct experience of something, yet there are so many people who claim that what they have faith in is therefore the "truth".

hmmm, there we go, what are your thoughts?

:tu:

nn23

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hnnjsn
...in the eyes of God, Truth or whatever it is you refer it too.

Hellooooooooooooo,

Ok, just wanna throw this one in, these are my thoughts on the matter.

Belief and Faith are a tool to allow polite disreguard in discussion.....ignorance.

Belief and Faith are manefestations of the ego to give validation (when someone desires their point to be validated) to something that doesnt make sense in someone elses belief system (ego manefestation).

The context of Belief and Faith contradicts their purpose. Does God require people to believe in "him"? Surely Belief is only required when people have not had direct experience of something, yet there are so many people who claim that what they have faith in is therefore the "truth".

hmmm, there we go, what are your thoughts?

:tu:

nn23 I dont get it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
InnerSpace

Welcome back stranger. You've been missed. :wub::D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beastmode

Well..i can tell u in my life faith and belief is not meaningless....actually its the direct oppossite. Even if you do not believe what others believes doesnt mean that it is meaningless...esp if help people in any way,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MaiTino
Welcome back stranger. You've been missed. :wub::D

:lol: HA HAAA.... :wub:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MaiTino
Well..i can tell u in my life faith and belief is not meaningless....actually its the direct oppossite. Even if you do not believe what others believes doesnt mean that it is meaningless...esp if help people in any way,

...in the eyes of God, Truth or whatever it is you refer it too.

Is God not self evident?....Do you need to tell "him" that you believe in "him"?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beastmode

Well...as my point of view....true faith and belief is lived through our actions.....so for me yes..i need to show my faith, and i do believe that God cares if i show my faith rather than hide it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
brave_new_world
...in the eyes of God, Truth or whatever it is you refer it too.

Hellooooooooooooo,

Ok, just wanna throw this one in, these are my thoughts on the matter.

Belief and Faith are a tool to allow polite disreguard in discussion.....ignorance.

Belief and Faith are manefestations of the ego to give validation (when someone desires their point to be validated) to something that doesnt make sense in someone elses belief system (ego manefestation).

The context of Belief and Faith contradicts their purpose. Does God require people to believe in "him"? Surely Belief is only required when people have not had direct experience of something, yet there are so many people who claim that what they have faith in is therefore the "truth".

hmmm, there we go, what are your thoughts?

:tu:

nn23

For people it is different. They need faith and belief to compensate for lack of knowing the truth (me included). Though to experience enlightenment or God one needs to have faith in the appropriate belief in which one can transcend that belief. The belief is a means to an end. As one Buddhist onced quoted:

To have faith we rely on practice

To have wisdom we must know the truth

Faith is the prerequisite of wisdom.

:lol:

But once truth is found there is no longer need for faith or belief, I agree with that.

"The word "belief" is a difficult thing for me. I don't believe. I must have a reason for a certain hypothesis. Either I know a thing, and then I know it - I don't need to believe it."

---Carl Jung :D

Edited by brave_new_world

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MaiTino
Well...as my point of view....true faith and belief is lived through our actions.....so for me yes..i need to show my faith, and i do believe that God cares if i show my faith rather than hide it.

And why is it that you "believe" this rather than "know" it? Can you not see the contradiction?

Who is it that you "show" your faith too? Someone you "believe" to be there but do not claim you "know" to be there?

If you "know" God is there because you "believe"...linguistically speaking this fits into the argument i preposed...

Belief and Faith are manefestations of the ego to give validation (when someone desires their point to be validated) to something that doesnt make sense in someone elses belief system (ego manefestation).

God is self evident, what is the purpose of Belief and Faith?....

Belief and Faith are a tool to allow polite disreguard in discussion

Communication with others, and if this is the case, it kind of loses its sparkle that gives it such weight (meaning) within discussion dont you think?

The popular faith in words is a veritable disease of the mind ~ C.G Jung.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
brave_new_world
God is self evident, what is the purpose of Belief and Faith?....

The existence of God is not self-evident to reason, but it is demonstrable. ----St Thomas Aquinas (Christian mystic)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beastmode
And why is it that you "believe" this rather than "know" it? Can you not see the contradiction?

Who is it that you "show" your faith too? Someone you "believe" to be there but do not claim you "know" to be there?

If you "know" God is there because you "believe"...linguistically speaking this fits into the argument i preposed...

God is self evident, what is the purpose of Belief and Faith?....

Communication with others, and if this is the case, it kind of loses its sparkle that gives it such weight (meaning) within discussion dont you think?

The popular faith in words is a veritable disease of the mind ~ C.G Jung.

No one can 100 percent prove that God does or doesnt exsist.......but faith isnt based on things that we cant 100 percent be proved...if we could prove certain truths then there would be no need for faith. You see faith inst just a belief in something.....its believing in something and acting on it. Truth cannot be proven untill it is seen and tested. Right now we cannot see God or put Him to the test,,,so for now we cannot prove 100 percent that God exsists...but thats where faith comes in.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beastmode

So your saying that millions opon millions people for thousand opon thousands of years their faith and belief is worth nothing.......that a mighty big accusation to say.I dont think one person can nulify all the peoples faith through out history.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MaiTino
For people it is different. They need faith and belief to compensate for lack of knowing the truth (me included). Though to experience enlightenment or God one needs to have faith in the appropriate belief in which one can transcend that belief. The belief is a means to an end. As one Buddhist onced quoted:

To have faith we rely on practice

To have wisdom we must know the truth

Faith is the prerequisite of wisdom.

:lol:

But once truth is found there is no longer need for faith or belief, I agree with that.

Yes, the thing is it can only take people so far and by this time the "meaning" has become SO internalised that people forget that it is simply for communicating a justification of purpose to others within the duality of language. Once the conversation is over they take it home with them, internalised within the bindings of thought to keep hold of their purpose for fear of it leaving if they did not have their faith or belief...its TOTAL identification with the senses and mind!

While it is a prerequisite like a key to get the cogs ticking, once the cogs are ticking the key is no longer required its presence creates a finity. What can be believed can be unbelieved.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MaiTino
The existence of God is not self-evident to reason, but it is demonstrable. ----St Thomas Aquinas (Christian mystic)

OOOO thats a good quote :tu:

Is reason not a subject to object experience?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
brave_new_world
OOOO thats a good quote :tu:

Is reason not a subject to object experience?

What do you mean?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MaiTino
So your saying that millions opon millions people for thousand opon thousands of years their faith and belief is worth nothing.......that a mighty big accusation to say.I dont think one person can nulify all the peoples faith through out history.

Worth is worth nothing.

Nothing is worth everything.

Does everything (existence, consciousness) require belief?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
brave_new_world
Yes, the thing is it can only take people so far and by this time the "meaning" has become SO internalised that people forget that it is simply for communicating a justification of purpose to others within the duality of language. Once the conversation is over they take it home with them, internalised within the bindings of thought to keep hold of their purpose for fear of it leaving if they did not have their faith or belief...its TOTAL identification with the senses and mind!

Hence it takes many life times before people get over beliefs and transcend them.

While it is a prerequisite like a key to get the cogs ticking, once the cogs are ticking the key is no longer required its presence creates a finity. What can be believed can be unbelieved.

Well it is alot easier said than done giving up beliefs that have become rooted in the unconscious. But I agree with you.

Edited by brave_new_world

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beastmode
Worth is worth nothing.

Nothing is worth everything.

Does everything (existence, consciousness) require belief?

otay... :huh: .....thats all in your opinion....and whats a person's worth.....maybe everyting to them but worth nothing to anyone else

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
brave_new_world
otay... :huh: .....thats all in your opinion....and whats a person's worth.....maybe everyting to them but worth nothing to anyone else

Dont feel confused. Nothing is something and that something is everything :D

Edited by brave_new_world

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
InnerSpace

"Faith is to believe what you do not see; the reward of this faith is to see what you believe. " ~Saint Augustine

"Faith is spiritualized imagination." ~Henry Ward Beecher

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
brave_new_world
"Faith is to believe what you do not see; the reward of this faith is to see what you believe. " ~Saint Augustine

"Faith is spiritualized imagination." ~Henry Ward Beecher

Intriguing quotes inner space. B)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
InnerSpace
Dont feel confused. Nothing is something and that something is everything :D

There's hope for you yet. ;):rofl:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beastmode
Dont feel confused. Nothing is something and that something is everything :D

aahhh..now i got it....lol thanks :tu:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MaiTino
What do you mean?

mmmm well, i believed your quote was in answer to my question...if Belief and Faith's purpose is to give reason, and reason is a duality, something you give as justification too (therefore drawing a subject to object distinction) ...and duality is a contradiction...and so on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
brave_new_world
mmmm well, i believed your quote was in answer to my question...if Belief and Faith's purpose is to give reason, and reason is a duality, something you give as justification too (therefore drawing a subject to object distinction) ...and duality is a contradiction...and so on.

But the duality at one level of existence is inevitable. As much as we know in theory what we are talking about, it is different to actually experience what we already are consciously......I've just contradicted myself again........paradox disease.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.